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Important - Everyone! Feedback needed please! | Forum

Darryl B Leader
Darryl B Aug 21 '16
Let's sum up some of the ideas
1. Accurate description, and representation of the item.
2. Limit the item forum topics for the dev. They should only need four.
A. Sticky and locked for updates
B. Sticky and locked for special item info
C. Sticky for bug reports
D. Sticky for suggestions
, and if the review system was taken out there could be a category for customer reviews.
3. Keep the main store clean by moving old items to a repository while keeping them active for use.
4. Implement a support policy with the possibility of an annual support fee to entice devs to stay and maintain their items.
5. Improve Oxwall side TOS to hold devs more accountable.
6. Improve the dev'x TOS to be inline with the Oxwall TOS.
7. Items are created for use on Oxwall, and are of no use to the dev elsewhere. If the dev no longer supports their item after a set period of time, they should be made available for another dev to update. Keep in mind here that no dev will want to just update, and take over free support. There needs to be something there for them after they take over.
8. Add buttons to report the store item, if the item is from a team member the email should go to their supervisor.
9. Have payment go through the Oxwall store with a 10 warranty period before issuing payment to the dev. During that period the consumer has the option to cancel the purchase which will refund their account, and remove the item from their store purchases.
10. Remove the review system, and replace with the last 14 item forum topics.

I think I covered everything so far.
I did miss one. If an item has significant enhancements the dev can introduce that as a new item. If it is bug fixes, or something the item needs for basic functionality, then that will fall into regular support. They need to work with all of the core plugins, and default theme, and depending on what the plugin is, it should also include features from core plugins (i.e. privacy, newsfeed...etc). The store moderation team will need to determine if there are missing features that the item needs.
The Forum post is edited by Darryl B Aug 21 '16
Darryl B Leader
Darryl B Aug 21 '16
Here's another thought to potentially protect consumers.  Instead of having payment go directly to the dev. Have payment go through the Oxwall store with a 10 day period for the consumer to determine whether the item works or not for their site. After that period the dev will receive the payment. During the period the consumer can cancel the purchase which will also refund their account, and remove the plugin, and license from their purchases. I guess it's like a warranty period.
Darryl B Leader
Darryl B Aug 21 '16
@Marcus Having the categories will keep things organized. Without them there would be bug reports, issues, reviews, and suggestions all mixed together.
They could look at the review section, and re-vamp it to show the last 10 reviews instead of the top review.
Darryl B Leader
Darryl B Aug 21 '16
I have edited the list above to include the newer ideas.
David
David Aug 21 '16
Maybe I misunderstood the term "core issues".  I was under the assumption that the plugins were not "core"... only recommended by core devs.  So if I got that line blurred a bit.. it's probably because the explanation of "core issues" seemed a bit vague to begin with, and I apologize.  However... the example I used can be held true to other plugins and devs who are not part of the core.  If we buy a plugin and it doesn't work... or there's a huge issue with it... and the devs say "I'll fix it in the next update" or "be patient, I'll fix it soon"..... and a WHOLE YEAR goes by... updates roll out again and again, but he's NOT addressing the issues.... why should we trust this guy?   Why should he (or she) continue to be able to be a part of the store?

On the issue of plugins that are no longer being maintained... I have several of them that I find extremely valuable...  why can't they be public domain after a certain time?  Meaning... why can't they revert to "free status", when they're abandoned?  Advanced Comments, for example... when the bugs are fixed (which I've done for my own site) still works very well... and it's awesome.  I wish I could have said the same for his customer support and relations... because he got a LOT of people emailing him with issues and he NEVER, not ONCE got back to any of us for any of the plugins he sold to us.

Which brings me to my next concern... what assurances do we have that the devs selling their stuff in the store... will EVER be accountable?   HOW do we make that happen?  If you SEE we're being ignored.... and we DO take it to the next level... how come they aren't being flagged... and their stores just simply removed?  When you develop a product (open source or not)... that's your reputation going out there, too.  But, Dave, more importantly... it's Oxwall's reputation, too.  Now I know people are going to cry "nonsense" to this statement.  But if Core is SOLID... and you guys push out a GREAT product... but it's marred by the crappiest store in history... what good is Oxwall as a product, or as a viable software for consumers?  Many users will associate the store with the core product.  If the store sucks and people are getting ripped off and treated like garbage from arrogant developers... then people will WRONGLY say "Oxwall is crap"... because the product is tied VERY closely to the plugins and themes we rely on.  Oxwall is AWESOME!  So it's not a question of whether WE deserve a better store experience. YOU... the developers....the team of Oxwall... DESERVE a better store.  In geeky Star Trek terms: You've designed the ultimate Starship... but if you screw up the warp core... it's not going to maintain orbit.  It'll decay... crash and burn.   Just sayin'. 
dave Leader
dave Aug 21 '16
My concern with the automatic refund is that how many people are going to exploit that and the developer has no way to talk to them to see if he can fix the issue first, they will just say oh im sorry i dont like it, cha-ching! i have hours and hours of the devs work in my pocket for nothing.  
The Forum post is edited by dave Aug 21 '16
dave Leader
dave Aug 21 '16
So basically what you want chris is to buy something one time and get a lifetime of support thereafter.  You want the developers to donate their work to oxwall just by signing up to the store.  So that if they decide to leave, their work stays here.  What you will find to happen is that when if that is the case then developers will start deleting their plugins before they leave and oxwall wont have a copy of it so there will be no opportunity to use it.  And if someone takes it over that dev will file suit for violation of intellectual propery.  


I hate to see that happen but if you force developers to basically donate their work thats what will happen.  



Chris do you know how easy it is to take someone elses work and make it so that it does not need a license.  Lets say that some poor guy wants a video plugin and he has no clue how to code one, or another dev is struggling with code and cant get it right, they will just buy my plugin copy the code and then come back and say oh sorry it dont work i want a refund, and bam they get my work for free. 


Now most of this is currently the case as we speak, it is also part of being in an open source community, there is risk, but at least i get the chance to say let me fix it it first. I would feel much better about some of this if we were allowed to encrypt part of the code so that it could never be used on another domain but it would be open enough for the customer to fix if they had to. 


sorry i had to combine the two posts, i have to keep marcus off my back lol 




The Forum post is edited by dave Aug 21 '16
dave Leader
dave Aug 21 '16
There just has to be some kind of protection to keep people from passing stuff around, thats all im saying. If someone left their car parked out on the street for 6 months would you consider it a free car?
dave Leader
dave Aug 21 '16
I understand that, but some of the suggestions seem to make that an easier thing to do. 
dave Leader
dave Aug 21 '16
i am going to go have some birthday cake and relax, talk to everyone later have a great day all. 
Darryl B Leader
Darryl B Aug 21 '16
Here's a solution to help that. currently every user has a developer key. Remove that feature, and have developers apply for one. That should help, but not totally prevent copying since the developer key is an important piece of the puzzle.
The Forum post is edited by Darryl B Aug 21 '16
Darryl B Leader
Darryl B Aug 21 '16
The problem isn't so much with up to date items with active support. It's with aging items with no support. If the dev is no longer able to, or interested in maintaining their plugin, they should consider turning it over, or have it moved to a repository so no more users can be hurt from purchasing it.
The Forum post is edited by Darryl B Aug 21 '16
David
David Aug 21 '16
I say we just nuke Montana and parts of Cleveland.  :-) 

Hey, if I buy Cheetos at the store... I don't expect a lifetime supply... but I DO expect that one bag of Cheetos won't be moldy and inedible.  Fix it for me for the foreseeable future, in realistic terms... or refund my money... it seems simple to me.
David
David Aug 21 '16
PS - Happy Birthday, Dave.
dave Leader
dave Aug 21 '16
LMAO David too funny, thanks 
dave Leader
dave Aug 21 '16
OK one last thing then ill go... .what about a fee to purchase the rights to the code.  If someone leaves they can sell you those rights then you can do what you want.  
David
David Aug 21 '16
GREAT idea, Dave!  I LIKE that a lot!
Darryl B Leader
Darryl B Aug 21 '16
That could be an option, if the dev can be reached.
David
David Aug 21 '16
Are themes that don't function properly with ANY plugins... that also override core features... be sold for $28.00 bucks?

Are plugins that do very basic things that require the purchase of ADDITIONAL plugins in order to work... worth $100.00... and why is that allowed?  To me.... if that's the route we're going... Oxwall won't be worth it before long.
David
David Aug 21 '16
So... ummm.. I guess what I'm asking is... what about price caps?
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