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SKADATE/OXWALL CANNOT MAKE IT WORSE | Forum

Topic location: Forum home » Support » Oxwall Store
Patricia Zorrilla Leader
Patricia Zorrilla Jul 31 '20

SkaDate CANNOT install my plugins "to be tested", that is ILLEGAL.

https://developers.oxwall.com/forum/topic/67135?page=1#post-247152

Licenses for use must be purchased through the OxWall store, or given away by the plugin author, but Skadate HAS NO LEGAL RIGHT TO INSTALL MY PLUGINS WITHOUT LICENSE.


1) The licensing system is stupid and almost everyone knows how to cancel it.

2) When selling a plugin, the author ALREADY KNOWS that there are going to be many installations for each sale, so what really works is if you have the PHP code or not.

3) With the new rules of the store, it is also not possible to know where the plugins are installed to maintain a list of websites that use plugins fraudulently.

4) For all my plugins I maintain a demo website


Is it worth making plugins if the owner of OxWall / Skadate downloads them taking advantage of the fact that he has access and installs them there?

Sumate
Sumate Jul 31 '20
Until now I had heard many things, be it the exchange of plugins and the piracy of the license, but this is new, now if you have left me speechless, it is a total violation of all the regulations and the terms of use.
dave Leader
dave Jul 31 '20
I am working on an answer for you....  my feeling is that if they want to test something they need to ask for a grant copy just like we do with their plugins, it is common courtesy.
The Forum post is edited by dave Jul 31 '20
Patricia Zorrilla Leader
Patricia Zorrilla Aug 3 '20

If there are no defenses against hacking, you cannot prevent certain users from acquiring plugins, the store rules are becoming more stringent, hardly anything is sold and SkaDate is giving away copies "to test", I see no point in publishing more plugins.

I hope the situation improves.

4 Everyone
4 Everyone Aug 3 '20

Sorry Dave, your intentions will be absolutely fine, but Oxwall and/or Skalfa or Skadate really don't care at all about what others think or their opinion.

These 3 companies are just playing with people and are now probably laughing hard when they read this.

They just do what they want and use good-natured people in our eyes.!

It is bad enough that they never participate in the discussions themselves and leave that to others which they have stretched for their wagon.

The end result will always be that good benevolent developers walk away.!


Pure our opinion.

dave Leader
dave Aug 3 '20

I am still waiting on a reply, i will keep you posted.


Rob yes your opinion - we dont know for a fact that they dont care, there may be challenges that we cannot see.   Yes it would be nice if they communicated better but we cant allow ourselves to fill in the blanks with opinions as fact.  :) 



AppXprt
AppXprt Aug 3 '20
I don't understand? 
I thought Oxwall downloaded the plugin for testing upon initial upload to the store for Quality Assurance?

I don't see any issue and I don't think they are violating any policy by checking to make sure something works?
dave Leader
dave Aug 3 '20

yes we do check all themes and plugins this way.  Then they are deleted from the test area.


However (if i am correct) patricia is concerned about them doing so as a different division of the company and not having the courtesy of asking first.   If i am correct, her concern would relate for example if the NFL downloaded a teams playbook just so they can look at it and without stating a reason why they would need it.   In other words she feels that just because  Oxwall falls under the same company umbrella does not give them authoritative rights to grab plugins at will without asking first.  We dont do that with skalfa plugins (unless they are being tested original submission) and they should not do it with ours.


The store code and store policy is under Oxwall not Skalfa or Skadate. So Oxwall rules apply IMO and they need to ask first IMO.  But we will wait for that ruling on the subject.

The Forum post is edited by dave Aug 3 '20
AppXprt
AppXprt Aug 3 '20
Hmmm, yea that does seem a little sketchy.


When you're testing it upon upload, are plugins testing to be working under both Oxwall and Skalfa at the same time or just Oxwall?

Maybe a customer requested to see if that specific plugin worked on Skalfa itself, before purchasing?



dave Leader
dave Aug 3 '20
We test it only for Oxwall...   And that is possible that a customer asked, but they still need to show common courtesy and ask first IMO
Patricia Zorrilla Leader
Patricia Zorrilla Aug 3 '20

They have installed it on a website that is not for testing.

That's the problem. They are not allowed to distribute it to their customers for testing and if they like to buy a license ... or don't buy it.

My plugins are all tested on SkaDate, I have a SkaDate license for testing and a testing site with SkaDate and another with OxWall

This means that the license system has been canceled, if not, it cannot be installed.

This presupposes that they have done it more times.

dave Leader
dave Aug 3 '20

I was not aware they installed it on a (other than for testing) website which may be the customers website (but we do not know that yet).  But if true yes i agree that cannot stand and must be stopped going forward.   I agree this may mean they have done so before but we have no actual facts on that.   Its wrong of them if this is true and someone should be repremanded for this action. 


I shared the link to this topic in my request for ruling so they will see this. 


The Oxwall store should NEVER be used as a Skalfa or Skadate free buffet of plugins..



The Forum post is edited by dave Aug 3 '20
Sumate
Sumate Aug 3 '20
Dave, what chance is there that we can integrate our own licensing system, would it come as an extra verification?
The Forum post is edited by Sumate Aug 3 '20
dave Leader
dave Aug 3 '20
Zero unless we can get access to the store code... The last person with access i believe was Den and not sure if he will release that or not.   We have asked before. 
Sumate
Sumate Aug 3 '20
A developer, when selling a product can see the assigned license, I as a developer, can I integrate my own verification into my plugin, or would I be breaking a rule?
dave Leader
dave Aug 3 '20

Lets not drift too far off topic here, however... :)


According to the new rules, the only callback you can have is during the install process and it can only contain feedback data for site url, site ip, site email, timestamp of installation, and license key and nothing more.


https://developers.oxwall.com/forum/topic/66888


Now if you can develope a plugin that allows oxwall to use ionCube for a specific file then that would be a jump in the correct direction because then we could add a validation file they users  cannot read and IMO i dont think that will violate any open source rules of the company.   But again i would need to ask for a ruling and clarification on that. 


I made a low effort attempt to use ionCube with Oxwall years ago with no success but that does not mean it cant be done.     However that would mean that oxwall would need to validate the validation file since it would be obfuscated.  It would open the door to allowing someone to exploit obfuscated code for malicous purposes.  So Oxwall would need to be able to verify that obfuscated verifcation file somehow either by bit compare or some other process.  The deal is that if a ionCube file should be created and used, there would never be any reason for that cube file to change value unless its just a text version call update.  However the version calls are usually done via htaccess so if its a very simple cube file then it should never change.


Now back on topic,  patricia i am sorry that happend, i will let you know as soon as i hear something...

The Forum post is edited by dave Aug 3 '20
dave Leader
dave Aug 3 '20
You can start a new topic if you want Sumate and we can discuss possibilities and testing results there :)
dave Leader
dave Aug 4 '20

OK  folks i have the official ruling. 


Skadate must ask before installing a plugin from any developer for free. They are not allowed to use the plugins. No presumed permission to do that is included in Store terms. If the developer grants a free test license, then it's ok.  Otherwise, the site owner or Skadate must purchase a license. They are allowed to buy one license and to use it as test license across many sites, but not at the same time.


I will contact skadate myself and advise them of the policy.  


Patricia, should this happen again please let me know.  



Sumate
Sumate Aug 4 '20
Good job Dave!
dave Leader
dave Aug 4 '20
TY SIR :)